Public Policy Polling (D)
9/13-14/08; 1,077 LV, 3%
McCain 48, Obama 44
(8/14: McCain 45, Obama 45)
This is the umteenth poll in a row showing McCain leading in OH by at least 3....OH should be on the verge of going pink on the map.....its been pretty consistant lately showing a McCain lead....
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:18 AM
PPP will have a poll for VA tomorrow...I can hardly wait. (I need a life!). Ohio is still possible for Obama, but is looking less and less likely. I suspect Mrs. Clinton will be spending a lot of time in Ohio.
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:22 AM
This should pretty much put the last nail in the coffen putting Ohio in the Red column.
With FL going red, it looks like VA, CO, NH, NV are the only ones left that can turn blue.
I'd keep my eye closely on VA.
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:23 AM
Ummmmm! Because of new registration voters record of over 900,000 for democrats in OH if I were McPa"lies"n I wouldn't take for granted OH based on such a slim lead
BTW Bush won OH by 2 points (100,000 more votes than Kerry)
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:27 AM
Yes... two months from election day... and a poll showing McCain showing only 48% of the vote in Ohio puts the nail in the coffin. The only poll the shows McCain at 50% is a Zogby internet poll.
Lets be realistic Ohio is still wide open but leans a bit towards McCain.
Ohio is full of Bozos if this poll is correct (at least 48% Bozos). Here are all the reasons the Repugnantkins are responsible for the Economic Disaster (or some of them, anyway):
Republican policies that resulted in current crisis (for Boomer):
(1) Restriction of FTC action (started severely under Reagan).
(2) Restriction of SEC action (started
(3) Privatization of Fannie Mae and later Freddie Mac's invention and privatization (Reagan).
(4) Greenspan March 2002 at Senate Finance Committee Hearings: ""The notion of a bubble bursting and the whole price level coming down seems to me as far as a national nationwide phenomenon, is really quite unlikely,"
(5) "Greenspan, who calls himself a libertarian Republican"
(6) President makes both monetary and fiscal policy in this country. Congress investigates, passes laws, passes final budget if they can get it signed by Pres. Pres. proposes budget. Repubs. misrepresent the way Congress actually functions to shift blame to Dems. Dems only have had slim majorities in Congress since 2004. No override power.
Been said on this board many times.
(7) Worst tax bill in world was passed by this President and a Repugnican congress, just before attacks of 2001; Failure to repeal worst tax bill in world after attacks altered fundamentals of American Economy.
(8) "Great Country" with nearly 50 million people who can get sick and die tomorrow and would have to declare bankruptcy, with the state paying for their funeral.
Please, US is speeding toward trash can status, boomy.
(9) Justice Department was turned into a Repugnantkin bastion by Gonzalez (illegally). Note that although Congressional hearings have been held, and the famous midnight ride through the streets of Washington to the bedside of a sickened Atty General was detailed, no one did anything wrong according to the secret laws of this President.
Note: FTC, SEC, and Justice all under President's direct control, with advise and consent of the Senate, which, has all been subject to secret deliberation.
10) Energy policy set by VP under great secrecy rules. As we citizens understand it, all rules were NOT subject to Congress. approval and largely made by signing statment, several of which are secret.
11) End of Democracy through secrecy. Even on economic policy.
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:29 AM
Registered voter does not equal voting voter....Dems always register tons of voters who never vote...Each cycle I hear about the great # of youth to show up and vote for the Dem, they never vote. So don't confuse voter registration with actual voters.....this is why likely voter polls usually favor the GOP over registered voter polls....the Dems just don't have enough busses to get them all to the polls to actually vote.
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:33 AM
I think people are mistaking OH currently leaning red, with "will go for McCain in Nov." There can always be actual movement! Just like we've seen in regard to McCain since his convention. The fact that economic issues have been relatively dormant leaves open a real possibility for some movement in the "rust belt" area where the economy has been hard-hit.
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:34 AM
Yeah the dems have registered new voters, but who's to say they aren't proportionally represented in this poll? I mean, they call people up and if they are registered voters, they can participate. It's not like they don't let people respond if they are new registrants....
5 of the last 8 Ohio polls have McCain +4. Looks pretty clear to me.
Ummmmm! Because of new registration voters record of over 900,000 for democrats in OH if I were McPa"lies"n I wouldn't take for granted OH based on such a slim lead
BTW Bush won OH by 2 points (100,000 more votes than Kerry)
CAN SOMEONE OFFER AN counterargument ?
Pollster shows trend line in McCain's favor and this should change the map color.
538 has Ohio as "pink" and 70% chance for McCain.
No change on RCP map yet.
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:37 AM
I know it makes you feel better to attack Reagan, but, just apiece of advice, you should stick with attacking Bush....its not the smartest thing to do when you attack one of the most popular president swe've ever had...Reagan. I would stick with Bush, Reagan my freind, is way out of your league. I realize the left isn't happy unless its attacking a republican, but again, just stick with Bush.
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:38 AM
Under 30 group at only 49% support for Obama?
He beat Hillary in this group w/61% support in this group in Ohio Primary..
I hear a lot Dems talking about newly registered voters. The truth is that of all the voters who are registered after 2006, 47% are Dems and 45% are Reps according to their ID (I read in this site itself). I dont see much difference here.
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:41 AM
The level of anger and rage from the Obama fans and, ahem, "Independent thinkers" is quite telling. If they are showing this much rage at a freakin' poll, what are they going to do if Obama loses? Good lord. Never let facts get in the way I suppose!
The definite trend in Ohio, for now, is towards McCain-Palin. Calling them 8th grade names isn't going to change that fact.
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:42 AM
I would ordinarily agree with you but this time the tons of voters have a reason to vote. This is why I have repeated ask for the weightings on the Rasmussen Poll. I think the Obama campaign knows something we don't. Also, the liberal radio was reporting that the McCain campaign was sending out bogus absentee ballots in Ohio. If this is true, then they are worried. I think this state is a stone cold tossup. If AA's participation rate is 80% of registered, then what would you say? And do you think Rasmussen is still using 55%-60%? If Rasmussen is using 55%-60% and the race tightened to +1% McCain, then what is the real number. I'm surprised more people aren't paying attention to this.
Internals look good -- except 56% of respondents are women. So it's likely that McCain has slightly more support among voters than indicated by the poll.
Can you really deny that Obama has the youth in this country excited? Can we throw out the unprecedented democratic primary participation? In John Kerry and the AlGore2000 we had a chance to see two of the more boring presidential candidates this country has seen. I'd argue that things are looking a little different this time around.
Recent Ohio polling has been good for McCain, but I do think we're still seeing a convention/VP bounce. As I've said with Virginia, this state isn't out of reach for anyone until after at least the first debate.
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:44 AM
Kudos for PPP!!! Although it is a Democratic pollster, if you look at the internals, you will find the demographics they are using are far from Obama-biased.
This sample is more Republican-friendly than SurveyUsa's released yesterday. In this PPP the democratic advantage is 6% vs. SurveyUsa 9%. Indeed, PPP reduced the democratic advantage from its August poll.
This PPP poll has a remarkably smaller 18-29 % than SurveyUsa's, 13% vs. 23%. Actually, I think they are underestimating that group in comparison with those voting 4 years ago. This PPP has 13% of voters age 18-29; however, this group was 21% of those voting in 2004 in Ohio.
Likewise, yesterday's SurveyUsa, this poll has 20% of voters 65+; however, these voters were 12% of those voting in 2004. 20% is the % of voters 65+ in Florida, the oldest state in the nation.
*I think it is a good poll, no one can cry bias. The numbers are pretty much in line with other pollsters.
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:47 AM
Virgnia is more winnable than Ohio.
The night prior to the election Obama will be in either Virgnia or Colorado.
1.). Virgnia will have twice the size of the black turnout than Ohio.
2.) Virgnia's population is more affluent, progressively liberal, and in-tune with Obama's change-message. McCain garners twice the amount of Dems in Ohio than compared to Ohio. (Thank you Southeast Ohio..or what I call Alabama. Obama couldn't get more than 15% in all those counties).
3.) Virgnia has an emerging socio-economic population, while Ohio is economically crumbling to the ground. Hello...Northern Virgnia..say goodbye Cleveland.
** great college turnout (more liberal)
** young professionals..emerging job market
** relative geographic closeness to D.C (northeast corridor)
5.) Virginia has core establishment backing Obama on both sides of the political fence. (Warner, Webb, Kaine, and Virginia's first republican gov. who is 85 years old).
Counterargument? A couple.
•Yes, voter turnout. Democrats always ahead on registration, but historically lacking in voter turnout.
•In Ohio, McCain gets 16% Democrats. (43% participants. (So
•In Ohio, McCain gets 89% Republicans (37% participants)
•In Ohio, this poll shows a 25 point swing to McCain among Independents for McCain 45/Obama 37 (20% participants).
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:48 AM
A large military/vet presence in Virginia (and Florida) and they are not necessarily "progressively liberal." Do not forget that African American turnout in Virginia also includes military and they too are not necessarily Obama voters.
Warner and Webb ran/run as fiscal conservatives and centrists. Although they both support Obama, that is where the similarities end.
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:54 AM
still seeing convention/vp bounce...
then what happened to the Obama convention/vp bounce one week earlier? Were we still seeing that last week?
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:57 AM
That is correct, VA has heavy military presence....and military voters usually favor the GOP.
Posted on September 16, 2008 11:58 AM
"then what happened to the Obama convention/vp bounce one week earlier? Were we still seeing that last week?"
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:03 PM
If you compare the % of small town, urban, suburban, rural in the composition of this poll to the actuall 2004 election, you will find quite a few discrepancies.
First, this poll has 20% rural and 20% small town. Was that the case in the 2004 election? Well, it looks like no. It was 19% rural and 6% small town.
Second, this poll has 18% urban; however, in 2004, it was 25% urban.
Third, this poll has suburban at 42%; however, in 2004, it was 49% suburban.
As you can see some republican-friendly areas in this poll are overrepresented, and at the same time, democratic-friendly areas are underepresented.
Why is this important? Well, urban areas is where the core democratic vote is. What happened with Kerry? He of course won urban areas; however, the margin was smaller than even Gore's in 2004. Kerry won urban areas by 17% vs. Obama is winning urban areas by whooping 27%.
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:04 PM
political wire is reporting that Obama's numbers in tomorrow's PPP poll are excellent.
With 50 days to go ... It looks like Colorado, Virginia, and Nevada will be the 3 key swing-states that the Obama team will be targeting to win come election night.
Look at the weekly registration numbers... this shows you that Obama will probably win all three of these states.
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:05 PM
Ohio is clearly trending for McCain, but does anyone know the details of the PPP likely voter model?
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:06 PM
tomorrow is ppp virgnia..
Let's face it, but Obama is not going to win Ohio. It's Virgnia stupid.
Time to unleash Jim Webb.
About Virginia, I am not so sure what is going to happen there; however, judging by the 2004 polls at this time, that state is really going in a very different direction than it was 4 years ago. Will that be enough? I really don't know, but if you go back to the poll archives, the race is a total different race than it was in 2004. A real exception.
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:08 PM
I think people are clutching at straws here and comments on Virginia, this is a good poll. there is a suggestion that we don't have to wait for the Bradley effect, we can see the racism in the undecided white vote breaking to McCain.
This and other polls I have been looking at are in a way pretty good news for Obama as McCain has peaked and is now on the way down.
These newly registered voters will be more than motivated by hope but also by fear into voting this year.
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:09 PM
still living in your elitist tower? What will determine Virginia is everything outside DC! You have no clue that there's a whole world outside of your corrupt crime-ridden failing cities. We ARE America, and our communities are working. BTW, Alabama will have huge black turnout. Don't assume they'll give it to your precious Harvard-grad elitist, Obama. He doesn't understand the rest of America any more than you do.
Right, if your an undecided voter and don't vote for Obama, you must be racist...... is there nothing new in your playbook at all on the left? Racism is the only thing that can defeat Obama right? Its all racism. You guys have got to get soemthing new....perhaps if you stop calling everyone racist, you can get more support....huh?
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:12 PM
@RaleighNC : I know it might not be politically correct but a lie is a lie, I am not saying that everything coming from the Obama campaign is 100% true. However, it's clear that we cannot compare by any means the amount of lies/distortions from the McCain campaign with those coming from the Obama one.
Having said that, I do agree that 4 years ago voters registration in OH was very high but seemingly they didn't turn out, OK
nonetheless, it might be smart to take into account a couple of parameters that lack in 2004
1- A great deal of those new voters are young and they could overwhelmingly be reached on election day or the day before via text messages, myspace etc
2- Like it or not the enthusiasm gap is indisputable and it's much higher than 2004
3- in OH on election day people will be able to get registered and vote right away, that means in campuses students will be helpful, needless to say whom those students are most likely to vote for ...
4- They are much at stake this year. In 2004 the economy wasn't that bad and young voters were more concerned by National Security.
This is why I say a 3-4 points lead is not that good, it's not that I am trying to downplay the McCain lead I am just making a point which seems logical given the current political environment
Any counterargument is welcome ...
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:18 PM
Repugnantkins may think that the Teflon President was a great king, but most Dems. think he was pre-senile dementia at all times.
The history of the pre-senile President has not been written, yet.
We will find out that his Policies (except for some of Volcker) were responsible for much misfortune for years after, when it is.
Teflon and Alzheimers are a bad combination.
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:19 PM
That is what the undercurrent of the narrative is.
Now that we can see the geography of the polling its pretty clear that that is likely to be the case.
I have told you that McCain is unelectable because of ageism.
We live in a country that stil has discrimination on age, gender and ethnic grounds.
I am more aware of that than most because I have other countries that I can compare the US to first hand.
You know that in Scandanavia, Holland, Germany, France, the UK that Palin's gender wouldn't be a topic!
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:20 PM
Let's face it people read too much into lack luster poll numbers for both candidates.. a 2-4% lead in a LV model with a MoE around 3% taken over the weekend? Neither candidate is exactly burning things up here.
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:22 PM
everybody knows the "teflon" president was slick willie, and everything you said about him is true. silly lib.
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:25 PM
Well I am not at all surprised that a libral is calling everyone else a racist. You guys are so blinded by ideology you simply cannot see what is right in front of you. Its not racism that makes the Indy's hesitant to vote for Obama, its liberalism. You can go on thinking everyone hates balck peole, etc, that is your thing....people have a natural instinct to oppose big g'ment and big g'ment dependency. It has nothing to do with race...people especially in this country don't want to forfeit control of there lives to the all mighty g'ment.
You can lash out, call people racist, etc, it will not work. Its a typical move right out of the liberal playbook.....page 1. If someone does not agree with you or support you in every way, they either hate blacks, women or old people.....I mean this is the same stuff your side has yacked about for 40 years.
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:26 PM
From the PPP blog site on Monday evening:
We'll have the Ohio poll tomorrow and the Virginia poll Wednesday. I would say each of them is good news for one of the campaigns.
So Ohio is good for McCain, I can't wait to see how "good" Virginia is for Obama.
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:27 PM
Libertarian do you mind,
I am observing, age, gender, and race discrimination in the US which you seem to be in denial of.
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:34 PM
...born in California in 1951... were you a sixties anti-war protester? What did you think of Governor Reagan? Curious.
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:35 PM
I gotta tell ya, I am getting real tired of liberals calling me a racist or a sexist or any other ist.....all the left does is throw out name calling unless you support everything onthe left wing agenda. Like it always does, name calling simply will not put Obama in the WH....so you guys can call people who don't support your guy any name you want, it won't work.
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:37 PM
You're clearly no liberal....don't you ever just get tired of the other side calling you names like racist...or sexist, etc? Its just getting so old.
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:38 PM
I didn't call you any names, did I?
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:52 PM
thoughtful...conveniently forgets that "old" people vote and in fact are the most reliable voters.
thoughtful... those white voters breaking for McCain is not based on "racism" but rather on conservative social values. Yes... Stillow... I am really sick and tired of Obamanation using "race" as the reason that their "boy" ain't doin' too good. No, I am not a racist. I do not even live in (and seldom associate with) "white land"-- liberal or conservative.
IndependentThinker... is ignoring that the same day registration/voting in Ohio is going to court.
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:53 PM
The only reason I chose my handle was to clearly show that I am conservative. Libs are often afraid of who they are and masquerade as unbiased "independent" thinkers. My views are a result of conservative thinking. Apparently so are yours.
I suppose people that don't really know who they are, what they think, or even what their world view is, are more easily backed into a corner and resort to name-calling by default. We see it as childish.
Your arguments are backed up with facts--those things they seem to fear the most.
Posted on September 16, 2008 12:56 PM
I'd rather not associate conservative social values with sexism, or racism as you seem to be doing.
Obama is winning this election: he is way ahead of Kerry on 2004. IA is firmly Blue. NM is leaning heavily, VA will be in tomorrow, CO is leaning and as Stillow will tell you Obama is well in with a chance in Nevada.
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:08 PM
I am wondering if "thoughtful" has always been a liberal like many of the young vietnam war era crowd, or he/she made a transition to liberalism sometime along the way. Most of those that shifted seem to have done so toward the right, not the left. It's difficult to find a truly ideological liberal. Most of the ones I talk to pick and choose their beliefs on a daily basis. They are also very pessimistic. If I was a true liberal, I think I would be able to define my self and at the same time be happy about it.
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:11 PM
Actually, I myself always had considered myself a liberal (albeit a pragmatic one), but now because of the bad behavior of Obamanation I do not call myself that anymore. I cannot tell them from the so-called "right-wing conspiracy" of the Clinton years. Both are way too-far-from-center radicals (and seem to have NO common sense... aka pragmatism).
Obama's liberalism is scary. It leans toward nationalized socialism and reeks of oligarchy. Kind of a larger version of the Chicago Political Machine... which may occur if combined with a Reid/Pelosi Democratic Congress.
I prefer McCain because he is a known quantity and is proven bipartisan. I like Palin because of her family values and she hunts for food. Really!!! Because where I live almost everybody depends on wild game and fishing to supplement their food supply. (No, it is not Alaska, but be assured it is rural.)
As of now, I have not figured what to call myself since "liberalism" is now wholly tainted with extremists.
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:13 PM
obama is winning...
and ohio state was clearly winning the USC game.
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:14 PM
You seem to look at life in black and white.
There are many shades of grey in between and then there's color.
The truth is that any given situation can be observed from very many perspectives.
There are more than one solution to many problems.
More than one answer to a given question.
These are things that we know to be true.
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:17 PM
NO...thoughtful... It is YOU who has associated conservative values with RACISM and SEXISM... NOT ME!!!! Get your head out of DIVISIVE politics.
Yea I watched most of the game the trojans were pretty awesome.
Who's winning in IA?
Classify the other states NM etc.
Look at Kerry was in 2004 incomparison same date.
Don't be too depressed Obama will be a good President.
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:21 PM
Are you certain that you are not racist or sexist?
Have you carefully contemplated the possibility?
Are you surprised that McCain hasn't articulated the issue, by saying something like 'I do not want people to vote for me because I am white; I want people to vote for me because they trust my leadership on the issues'.
In truth, Karl Rove tried to get this articulated, but he mangled it; I believe he did so on purpose.
There are very, very, very serious problems in the Republican psyche that we have only begun to explore.
Democrats, not so much. Very heterogeneous group. Can't get two in a room without finding huge disagreements. Repubs., not so much.
Divisive politics: You must be kidding!
What do you call it when you fire US attorneys for not prosecuting people of the other party?
Divisive politics are what Bush Republicans are all about.
What did McCain do about that?
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:24 PM
You repubs. have slammed the country into the toilet, and you have the gall to tell us you are saviors and saints.
What a bunch of crap!
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:25 PM
Your story is much like mine, and I certainly wouldn't want to be called a right-winger. You seem to treasure traditional family values, which definitely puts you right of center. Labels aren't really necessary if one relfects by his/her actions what he/she clearly believes. Personal views on some particular issues can range from one end to the other. But people need to have some frame of reference through which they form reasonable opinions. Otherwise they're just little boats gone adrift.
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:27 PM
I have seen NO racist or sexist remarks from Stillow, but I surely have seen Obamanation keep throwing "race" into the mix as a reason for people not to vote for Obama.
Well, I voted for Jesse Jackson in the primaries (1984-88) as well black mayors over my lifetime...and lots of women. So I can truly say that I have a record of NOT being racist or sexist. Yet, I think Obama is extraordinarily RISKY. He tells people what he "thinks" they want to hear, not what he is actually going to do as President.
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:31 PM
1- I have desperately been searching a link to your same day registration counterargument, I didn't find anything hence could you provide me wih a link or anything else as evidence that it's going to court and the GOP might win
2- Do you have any counterargument about the fact that young voters can be reached out by text messages, myspace/facebook etc on the election day or the day before?
If they can be reached out there's no doubt they can turn out at an higher level than they do on previous elections
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:32 PM
Now doesn't it make you laugh when you read slinky's comment. Can't you picture a 1st grade kickball player that's been called out at first by his mom?
The same tech-savvy young voters might be reached quicker by repubs offering free beer to not vote.
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:38 PM
I do not have time or inclination for searching for a comprehensive link. But from my reading the counterarguments are:
1. The Ohio Secretary of State (Democrat) was only going to use same day registration/vote in urban areas. The Republicans said it had to be state-wide.
2. The same day registration/vote is a "loophole" that is an "interpretation" by the Democratic Secretary of State. A new law passed for early voting happens to overlap registration by 5 days. Registration is required to be 30 days before the election. Secretary of State says that because the "votes" will not be "counted" until election day then one can register and vote on the same day within that "loophole" time period.
The counter argument is that registration is 30 days before voting, not 30 days before vote is counted. And if the legislature wanted same day registration/vote then they would have specifically stated such.
If the Secretary cannot find "intent" from the legislature, then same day registration/vote is toast.
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:40 PM
I didn't write this; it was on a NYTimes blog. Feel free to explain it and disclaim it:
"I am a PA resident. My dad and his whole side of the family (aunts, uncles, cousins.. ) will vote for McCain. My mom and her entire side of the family will vote for Obama.
Much to my chagrin, my dad’s side of the family will vote for McCain as a vote against a black man for president. They were not initially excited about McCain because they remember him as the McCain of old (aka the maverick). Nor are they more excited about him because he picked Palin (they are not naive enough to believe she is qualified to be VP or commander in chief, if necessary)."
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:42 PM
to be a good person, McCain must come out and say something negative about this kind of thinking.
Both Dems and Republicans will be outreaching (and have always done so) to get voters to the polls. But oftentimes unless you actually drive them to the polls, many still just do not get there. Always good intentions, but distractions happen.
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:43 PM
Heh ya....I just read it, there side is just wacky. I like your kickball thing. Its difficult at tiem to even have a discussion with them.....they accuse the right of hate on so many different levels........I tend to get confused on which "ist" I am for the day when talking to them.
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:44 PM
It is always someone's "family" or "neighbor" who will not vote for Obama because he is "black." Kind of funny, init?
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:46 PM
It's funny KipTin, except that the post who has the "family" or "neighbor" is usually the one voting for obama because he's black
Posted on September 16, 2008 1:56 PM
With their kind of logic, only half-black-half-white people can make a fair choice about Obama. All others would be voting against or for their own half. Silly libs.
Oh geez, the if-you-vote-against-Obama-you're-a-racist line is beginning.
Yawn. Can't the multiculturalists think of anything else to motivate people besides white "guilt"?
Posted on September 16, 2008 3:07 PM
... .people have a natural instinct to oppose big g'ment and big g'ment dependency ...
Then why are you voting Republican? Clinton reduced the welfare rolls and left GWB a surplus. GWB and the Republicans have grown the government to the largest size ever, and created a huge deficit.
Why are the people who complain most about government "handouts" the elderly who are getting their government handouts? Why did the Republicans nominate someone for president whose family were at the government trough and who has been at the government trough his entire adult life and *never* worked a private sector job?
Posted on September 16, 2008 5:32 PM
Face it libs, Clinton had to cave to the repub congress that adopted Gingrich's contract with America soon after repubs swept the congressional elections in 94. It is what reduced welfare, increased revenues, and created a surplus.
Clinton takes credit for the republican successes. Notice now that the dem congress has a much lower popularity rating while doing nothing and blaming their failures on Bush.
Posted on September 17, 2008 9:34 AM
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