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TX: Texas Secession (DailyKos-4/20-22)


DailyKos.com (D) / Research 2000
4/20-22/09; 600 likely voters, 4% margin of error
Mode: Live Telephone Interviews

Texas

Favorable / Unfavorable
Pres. Barack Obama (D): 45 / 53
Gov. Rick Perry (R): 51 / 43
Sen. Kay Bailey Hutchinson (R): 64 / 29

Do you think Texas would be better off as an independent nation or as part of the United States of America?

    61% Part of U.S.
    35% Independent nation

    Republicans
    48% Part of U.S.
    48% Independent nation

Do you approve or disapprove of Governor Rick Perry's suggestion that Texas may need to leave the United States?

    37% Approve
    58% Disapprove

    Republicans
    51% Approve
    44% Disapprove

(source)

 

Comments
Mark in LA:

Those Texas Republicans really hate America.

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Stillow:

No my freind, they hate what the federal g'ment is doing to America........eventually you will or your kids will have to pay the bill of all htis over spending and it won't be pretty....you cannot continue to rack up trillions in debt and expect no consequences, but as usualy, most people cannot see but two feet in front of their faces....History will look back at Bush and Obama and wonder what in the hell were the people thinking, out of control spending and out of control g'ment expansion.

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change:

Stillow

you lunatic were was this rage against government where bush racked trillions in deficits by: Lying us into war in Iraq, and killed hundreds of thousands of people? Now your mad at obama for racking up debt because he is helping the economy survive through this reccession?
Your dad should have made you mother swallow you, you inbread dirty republican hick! Tea-bagger!

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Stillow:

Bush's approval ratings were so low because he lost the support of fiscal conservatives like me. Your side would follow Obama off a bridge...you can name call all you want, but BOTH Bush and Obama are spending us into destruction....I was railing against Bush for years for spending as were most fiscal conseratives...and you liberals were whining about to much spending...now that its your guy racking up trillions in debt its suddenly ok.

Well wait til you have to pay the bill...then we can see how well name calling works for you, of course by then liberals will ahve taxed name calling to help pay the debt intrest Obama and Bush have racked up....dumb and dumber these two were.

You don't justify bad behavior by pointing to other bad behavior....

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IdahoMulato:

Stillow

Now we know those who really hate America. So you want us believe that these nutjobs hate America b'coz of Obama? You keep mis-representing the facts on the ground.

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Stillow:

Do you actually read my comments?????? I am telling you people are ticked off at !!!!BOTH"!!!! Bush and Obama for spending money which we do not have. You lefties cannot get over the D and the R next to someones name. President Bush started a massive spending spree and President Obama picked up right where he left off. Its like you lefties are totally oblviious to what is happening...they are spending to much money!!!!
Your so blinded by your hatrid of Bush you totally ignore what everyone else is doing. the federal g'ment is killing our kids and grand kids. They are spending money that hasn't even been earned yet....can you guys not see the problem with that? I have no problem blaming Bush....Obama is doing the same thing he did, spending to much money....Obama ran on change, there's no change, all he is doing is the same exact thing, spending money we do not have.
You have to learn to see past your hatrid of Bush....any responsible American can see that spending money that we do not have can only cause us great harm....Bush did a lot of damage fiscally and Obama is carrying on his wreckless spending...so I blame BOTH!! Try to understand that. Both these guy have no clue. There was some hope after the election Obama would change direction, even I as a staunch fiscal conservative gave him a chance, because some of his campgin rhetoric made it sound like he would really change direction, which he didn't....when he simply carried on Bush's spending habits, that was the rock that broke the glass for many of us.
Get past your one sided views, your hatrid of Bush and see what is going on, both parties are spending us into permanant financial distress...
Can you honestly not see wha tis going on here? the country is being bankrupted by g'ment, not just dems or repubs, but by g'ment, its to the point now where it does not matter who is in power, cus both parties are doign the same damn thing.
This is why fiscal responsible conservatives from both parties turned out in mass at tea parties, because we see what is going on, they are bankrupting us, stealing money from our future generations...and then they have the nerve to say they still need to spend more. you cannot spend your way out of debt....we are witnessing the collapse of our dollar ight before our eyes and no one seems to give a damn, the g'ment just keeps spending and spending, your side balmes Bush to jutify Obama doing it, the GOP blames Obama....its a damned mess and you guys who claim to be informed ignore what's happening right in front of you because its more fun to slam Bush......
No wonder this country is falling apart...

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IdahoMulato:

Stillow

The tea bagging was organized by big corporations in concert with the NRCC, Fox News, etc. It's possible some conservative DEMS participated but I want to believe it was right wing thing.

To tell the truth, I really like Bush as a person but detest his party, GOP. I dont blame Bush for all our problems b'coz I know he did his best. However, the one thing I blame him is the tax cut to big wigs & companies, who afterall do not need such hude tax cuts. Our economic structure is based on spending & there4 spending is what drives economic & national income growth. So embarking on tax cust for the rich, who use more econocic resources & therefore should pay more taxes, will not drive growth.

The dollar has not collapsed as you want us to believe. I'm a member of the Chartered Institute of Management Accountants, UK. Last year when I paid my subscription, the dollar to sterling exchange rate was almost $2 to a sterling. However, this year I paid just $1.4145 to a sterling.

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Stillow:

Well you have the left wing talking points down perfectly. If 6 crazy people dressed in pink show up to protest a war the media and the left are see, look at the massive outrage over war....if 750,000 show up to a tea party in the middle of a work day its just the right wing...you guys are to funny.
It appears we will never agree, I guess you guys on the left just love spending money we do not have, growing g'ment massively, handing out entitelemnts, deciding who makes to much, deciding who should pay more.....yes, America, land of the free, unless you make money and are successful.
I am ocninced your side simply will not get it until the bill comes due for all this spending....the bill always comes due....and when the creditors come knocking o nthe door we will not be able to pay them, because the g'ment has spent us all into financial slavery.
But hey, keep spending, just spend spend spend....maybe I should do that with my personal finances too....rack up debt, max out all my credit cards and just keep spending.....you fiscal lefties out there just do not get it.
Part of me admires your support for Obama even as he leads you right off a bridge, but eventually you will rech that bridge and fall off. .
When one American says to antoher, you make to much money so we are taking it, then that is the end of freedom as we know it....because eventually the g'ment will get to your salary level It used to be millinaires were rich, then 500k, then 300k, then 250k, thne 180k...they will get down to your salary and take what you earn........I just wish you guys would come out for what you beleive and stop hiding from it....socialism, you want and trust the g'ment to alays do the right thing.
That is fine, you put your trust all in g'ment, put your faith in massive debt spending and all that stuff....we will see where it gets you. My guess is by the time you guys see what all this spending is going to do it will be to late to stop and ultimately our financial system will not be able to function...we are headed for a Jimmy Carter presidency with huge inflation, super high intrest rates and double digit unemployment....but hey, lets just spend trillions e don't have and all our problems will go away. Lets blame the GOP, which I actually do not mind, in the 90's the GOP were fiscal conservatives as they kept Clinton in check....but whenever the same party occupies both congress and the white house, spending goes up, way up.
We will never agree...now I am going to go now and max out all my credit cards....spend money I do not have and close my eyes and hope it all owrks out!

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Karl Smith:

Stillow,

What spending did you disapprove of from Bush for years. I understand the current debate over the stimulus and bailouts.

However, as Bush was racking up the debt over the previous eight years, what is it that he bought that you think he shouldn't have?

I ask because my look at the data is that the rack up in debt came not from increased spending, but from tax cuts. Bush cut taxes to one of the lowest percentages of the economy since WWII.

Obama's plan does not raise net taxes. It raises taxes for upper income and lowers them for lower income.

Unless taxes are increased the deficit cannot be balanced. Note: Clinton closed the deficit and increased economic growth by raising taxes.

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Stillow:

Karl Smith

First off, all Clinton did was create a bubble eocnomy that popped in the summer of 2000. I know a lot of people who still have not receovered from the credit bubble clinton created.
Perscription drug bill, no child left behind were just two examples of insane spending by Bush.
Obama's proposed spending has already outspent Bush...You people who lean left and support Obama are as foolish as the social conservatives who stood by Bush to the end. You ugys honestly think the road to recovery and prosperity is thru higher taxes and more g'ment spending.
We already had a formula for recovery. In 1980 Reagan inherited a much worse economy if you look at the numbers, he "cut" taxes and got g'ment out of the way....and the 80's were a time of a major job growth and investment.
The credit binge of the 90's started us all on the road to spending money we do not have...the credit bubble finally went bust in 2008. You simply cannot spend your way out of debt, g'ment cannot drive the economy.
By the way, Obama still claims foolishly that 95 percent of people will see a tax cut, that is very strange since less than 50 percent actually pay taxes..........
Last year my spuse and I paid 39% of our income to the federal g'ment, another 9.2% to the state in addition to 7.25% in sales tax for things we bought, in addition to the property tax we paid to own a home, in addition to all the misc taxes you see on every utility bill, phone bill, etc...in addition to the gasoline taxes and surcharges, in addition to the annual g'ment taxes on car registration, in addition to the capital gains tax I paid on my PIA accounts, in addition to hotel room tax we paid any time we traveled....and so on and so on, the list of taxes goes on and on and you speak of raising taxes so g'ment can spend more money.
Did it ever occur to you the problem might not be the level of taxation, but rather the level of spending?????? Has the left become so dependent on g'ment to manage their lives that all you can see is g'ment and how to get money to g'ment so it can spend and provide you the illusion of a good economy?
The people in this country are taxed at extremist levels and the left wants more, this is total madness. Just as the social conservatives who stuck with Bush are crazy, so are the leftist fiscal liberals for sticking with Obama.
There is only one difference I can see between Bush and Obama, Bush like to spend massive amounts of money hwile loweirng taxes, Obama likes to spend massive amounts of money by raising taxes, other than that they are the same.
Its saddens me none of you can see the danger in all this massive debt spending and g'ment growth. I listed just some of the taxes already imposed on the people of this country and you want more, raise them....if someone has a better job at earns more money, then by God we should take that money....
I spent six years going to college, paid for it all myself with part time jobs and student loans to get my degrees so that I could get a good paying job....tell me why is it fair for me to pay for soemone who decided to drop out of high school and just give him money from my earnings thru income redistirbution? What is the incentive for people like me anymore? Why work and achive if the g'ment can come along and seize your earnings in the name of doing the public good?
I am sick and tired of paying all the bills in this country, doing all the work in tis country and then told by people like you and on the left I have to pay more of my earnings because the g'ment needs more of it.
One day you guys are goin to get what your wanting, a country where no one works, no one want sto succeed and everyone is dependent on g'ment....the rich as you call them only have so much money, eventually it will run out, then who will you take from? I work hard for my money, many times 50 hours a week, that is time away from my kids, but I do it so they can have a good life and a nice home with good schools to go to, I did my time in college to learn a skill and I paid for it myself.....and its sickening to me that you fiscal liberals tell me I am bad for what I have and that I need to give more of my EARNINGS to the g'ment so pass out to to people who in many cases do not deserve it....that was the jist of th tea party thing, people like me who are doing the work and paying all the bills are tired of it. We want the g'ment out of our wallets and off our back because I am rleady paying to much in taxes...when you add it all up I am we over 60 percent of my earnings, that I go to work and earn taken from me, over 60 percent and you people want more!!!!!!!! I am looked at as the bad guy because I work hard, well ya know what, maybe one day, those of us that actually do our part in society will just stop, then what will you guys do? Who's money will you take= in th name of doing the right thing?
I am so furious that you guys want my money, I work for mine and a lot of us out there do and we are getting real tired of the g'ment and those who support big g'ment and debt spending like yourselves that you want mroe of what we wearn. No one gives me a dime, I pay my way....and I don't come from some uper class background, I come from middle class beginnings and I am middle class now....and it is that class, the silent majority in this country that is going to wake up to what the g'ment is doing, spending our existance away.....meanwhile you people on the fiscal left say don't worry, big g'ment and massive debt is ok....just keep giving us your money, if we need more we will come take it from you....
This country is losing its soul and people like you guys are helping it happen.

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Karl Smith:

Prescription drug bill I will buy but No Child Left Behind? The entire Department of Education has a budget of 56 Billion.

Even if all of it was scrapped including financial aid for college this would be less than 2% of the budget. Thats not just taking back NCLB, that is scrapping the entire Department and ending federal aid for poor kids trying to go to college and improve themselves.

Yes, I opposed the Prescription Drug bill and it is a doozy, but it is one bill and it was wildly popular with the Seniors who of course are the most reliable voters, so I didn't expect it to be stopped.

However, under Bush and Obama total taxes are lower than under Reagan. Indeed, Non-defense discretionary spending as percentage of GDP is lower than under most of the Reagan years.

Total government spending as percentage of GDP hit its peak in 1980 and has been fairly declining ever since. There is only a slight uptick in the last few years that mirrors the cost of the wars.

The deficit is not because the government is spending more, it is because it is taxing less.

And you are right, so many people have been taken off of the tax roles that the statutory rates on the highest income are growing.

Although I am not sure how you get to 39%. The highest income tax rate is 35% and it comes in after the payroll tax falls off. Even if you had no exemptions or deductions you would stop paying payroll tax for two people before the 28% bracket ran out.

Thus the most you could pay would be 35.35%, and thats a marginal rate, not an average rate. I don't think its possible to get to 39%.

Your account is stealing from you.

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Stillow:

39% comes from both my spouse and I's federal income tax paid, plus fica , plus medicare, plus my state ha some other program which takes another .08 percent...it adds up to a hair over 39 percent...
You just don't get it, youstill try and justify spending...lets just make it simple, how much of my overall income do you want from me from all tax sources combined, if 60 is not enough, how much? 70? 80? At what point is enough enough? The federal g'ment has only a few mandated functions from the consitituion, beyond that we are allowing them to spend way to much....and they keep coming after people like me....I admit, I am in the highest tax bracket, but no one is giving it to me, I earn it, I work for it. My money is taken from me and given away in the form of tax credits to people who pay nothing...I am funding failed g'ment program after failed g'ment program...social security is bankrupt, we all know taxes will be raised to support it, medicare is bankrupt, the education system is a total joke and yet we spend tens of billions on these....anytime the g'ment replaces a function which should be hld i nthe private sector it goes bankrupt. Because the g'ment outside of very very few things like the military cannot run anything efficiently, it is full of corrupt self serving pliciticans of both parties.
At some point the amoutn of taxes imposed on me becomes criminal, what percentage of my total income should I pay to the g'ment? Hmmm? 90? Everytime I hear a politican speak they want more of my money....I am tired of paying for cocktail parties and private jet service, I take coach on southwest.
Spend spend spend, all i am told is we need more money to save things like education....my daughter who is the 4th grade came home one day last year with a "Gay is okay" button pinned to her shirt she got from school....maybe if the schools would start teaching math and science it would get better, there is plenty of money there. I'm a fiscal conservative and a social libertarian, I support gay marrage, gay rights, immigration reform and abortion rights because the g'ment has no place telling people how to live their lives as long as it hurts no one else.
The bottom line is the g'ment is spending to much money...and is taking to much from the people who support it. Our tax code is insane, our spending is insane...and yet every single day I hear from people like you who want more, the answer to absolutely everything is the g'ment and in g'ment spending. This country was made great by the genius of its people, not the size of its g'ment.
It all comes down to kitchen table economics, when you sit down to pay your own bills, if more goes out than comes in, then you have to cut somewhere, stop spending less.
We will not agree, so just tell me how much of my overall income you spenders want from me so I can at least get a heads up of what is coming down the pipe for me....
I am telling you, there is a silent majoirty out there who is getting real tired of paying all the bills and being told by the g'ment they are not paying enough.

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Karl Smith:

Honestly, I want about 2.5% - 3% more in taxes. But not just from the rich, as under Obama's plan - from everyone.

In case you think that this solves nothing and is just an excuse for more tax and spend, I refer you to the 1990s when taxes were roughly 3% higher and this graph:

http://www.academycomputerservice.com/economics/deficit.jpg

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Karl Smith:

Also, sorry for the two posts but you will note on the graph that the turn around in the deficit happens immediately after Clinton was elected.

The Republican majority was not sworn into office until 1995. I don't think it was divided government, I think it was the President's polices.

The graph again just in case:
http://www.academycomputerservice.com/economics/deficit.jpg

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